Response to a Group Moderator
I received email today from a group moderator. First she mentions my "rocky time" on the group and apologizes for her group's less than gracious behavior. She also informs me that I am now unsubscribed from her list because I posted responses to posts from her group on this blog, using quotes, without ever asking anyone.
So here is my response to her email:
Dear Sally,
Thank you for your email and your kind words. My time on the group wasn't all that rocky for me, but it obviously was for you and your group. I cannot help that, since I didn't hurt anybody's feelings - How could I, since my posts were sitting in your moderator's inbox and never made it to the group. I said in my initial post that I did NOT want to discuss polygamy, but nobody ever really read that, it seems, which is not untypical, so you and your group made it rocky for yourself, and used me as an excuse to drag up all kinds of issues.
When you finally wrote your post inviting everyone to share their thoughts, that "everyone" obviously excluded me, since my voice was unwanted on your group. Your post was very open, inviting comments on everything, and so my lifestyle somehow ended up being part of many people's comments. It's an interesting position to be in, to be talked about and even talked at ("Talitha, if you are still a member of this group, ..."), without the chance to respond, which simple courtesy would already demand. So as for me quoting emails on our blog and probably also on the website without asking: Did you really feel comfortable with shutting me up like that and yet let others trash me, more or less openly, and you chimed in yourself too, more or less openly, and now do you really find it appropriate to complain that I had my say elsewhere "without asking" ? It sounds an awful lot like this is a most welcome excuse for you to get rid of me... You could have done that a long time ago and without any excuse, since it is your group, and you decide who you allow to join.
Since you would not let me talk to your group when they were talking to/about me, I used different ways to answer. Not even the post in which I explained why I preferred to address the topic polygamy on the website did you let go through, so how else do you suggest should I have said what I had to say? You obviously preferred for me to remain silent, both on your group and everywhere else. That didn't happen.
No names were mentioned when I quoted emails, nobody was personally attacked or slandered here, and if I had been granted the chance to post these things on your group, like the ordinary member that I was should be allowed to, I would gladly have done so. But you denied me that chance, thereby creating the problem that you now use as a reason to unsubscribe me from your group. Oh, by the way, I suppose you do not expect an answer to the standardized goodbye file, since the message in there doesn't make sense when applied to our little situation here.
You all felt confident enough to agree that polygamy is sin, that I am living in sin, though somehow you also all ended up saying that that's not a judgment. I commented on this blog about it, pointing out the difference between following God's assessments and relying on our own understanding. God does not condemn polygamy, he doesn't even make a difference between monogamy and polygamy, but calls both marriage. To say otherwise is to judge according to our own understanding. Yes, God is judgmental, very much so, and if you truly believe that He is sovereign, you should follow His judgments like His commandments. Calling for no judgment at all means to ignore God's supreme rule over all areas of life.
So here's my $0.02 worth on the whole matter. I hope your group will have smoother times in the future, and not be confronted with biblical truths anymore.
Grace and Peace,
Talitha
Technorati Tags: group discussion, polygamy, judgment, Joshuah's House
So here is my response to her email:
Dear Sally,
Thank you for your email and your kind words. My time on the group wasn't all that rocky for me, but it obviously was for you and your group. I cannot help that, since I didn't hurt anybody's feelings - How could I, since my posts were sitting in your moderator's inbox and never made it to the group. I said in my initial post that I did NOT want to discuss polygamy, but nobody ever really read that, it seems, which is not untypical, so you and your group made it rocky for yourself, and used me as an excuse to drag up all kinds of issues.
When you finally wrote your post inviting everyone to share their thoughts, that "everyone" obviously excluded me, since my voice was unwanted on your group. Your post was very open, inviting comments on everything, and so my lifestyle somehow ended up being part of many people's comments. It's an interesting position to be in, to be talked about and even talked at ("Talitha, if you are still a member of this group, ..."), without the chance to respond, which simple courtesy would already demand. So as for me quoting emails on our blog and probably also on the website without asking: Did you really feel comfortable with shutting me up like that and yet let others trash me, more or less openly, and you chimed in yourself too, more or less openly, and now do you really find it appropriate to complain that I had my say elsewhere "without asking" ? It sounds an awful lot like this is a most welcome excuse for you to get rid of me... You could have done that a long time ago and without any excuse, since it is your group, and you decide who you allow to join.
Since you would not let me talk to your group when they were talking to/about me, I used different ways to answer. Not even the post in which I explained why I preferred to address the topic polygamy on the website did you let go through, so how else do you suggest should I have said what I had to say? You obviously preferred for me to remain silent, both on your group and everywhere else. That didn't happen.
No names were mentioned when I quoted emails, nobody was personally attacked or slandered here, and if I had been granted the chance to post these things on your group, like the ordinary member that I was should be allowed to, I would gladly have done so. But you denied me that chance, thereby creating the problem that you now use as a reason to unsubscribe me from your group. Oh, by the way, I suppose you do not expect an answer to the standardized goodbye file, since the message in there doesn't make sense when applied to our little situation here.
You all felt confident enough to agree that polygamy is sin, that I am living in sin, though somehow you also all ended up saying that that's not a judgment. I commented on this blog about it, pointing out the difference between following God's assessments and relying on our own understanding. God does not condemn polygamy, he doesn't even make a difference between monogamy and polygamy, but calls both marriage. To say otherwise is to judge according to our own understanding. Yes, God is judgmental, very much so, and if you truly believe that He is sovereign, you should follow His judgments like His commandments. Calling for no judgment at all means to ignore God's supreme rule over all areas of life.
So here's my $0.02 worth on the whole matter. I hope your group will have smoother times in the future, and not be confronted with biblical truths anymore.
Grace and Peace,
Talitha
Technorati Tags: group discussion, polygamy, judgment, Joshuah's House
2 comments:
Hello Talitha.
I was curious to see if the groups posts were still here on your site and saw your response to "Sally". I was wondering if you sent your reply to her as well...privately of course since hers to you was private...or if you only posted it here in this public forum? Despite your feelings about how you were treated I am having trouble seeing how that has any relevance to posting others comments without permission. I am not saying that I know it is legally wrong to do so...I actually don't know if it is allowed when the names are removed. I do know I have been on many groups where it is against group rules to do so without permission. And I do know it is against "nettiquette". Anyway, you could have asked the moderator for that permission knowing she was seeing your emails at least. But to my knowledge you did not. I would think saying something like "one of the arguments I heard recently was...." and then paraphrasing would be sufficient as opposed to quoting someone exactly which gives the appearance that you joined the list (and others around the same time?) to get fodder for your blog.
I pray we all, no matter what we believe, always seek Him to show us the truth. We can all agree to pray for ourselves and each other on that!
Hello Crystal, and welcome back to the blog. It seems as though you last visited around Monday the 19th. We hope you find your time here profitable, find the fodder to be tasty, and come back often. ;-)
Thanks for your comment, which was allowed to be posted in the spirit of "do unto others as you would have them do unto you."
There are no group posts on this blog. There are quotes used, however, along with my wife's thoughts, opinions, and concerns...peppered with, most importantly, Scripture. This is, in part, the result of my wife being unable (denied the ability to) participate in the group discussions, even though she was graciously granted the ability to continue reading the insulting and unjust posts concerning herself. She had thoughts on the matter, and expressed them here. Her response to Sally was posted here also, since previous attempts to communicate with her privately were ignored.
You hint at legalities; allow me to hint at Scripture (1 Cor. 6:1-8). You mention Netiquette, but I would prefer to see a Christian etiquette. Paraphrasing is problematic, as you might be aware of in other circumstances (think Bible), and fodder is really unnecessary, as we have plenty to say already, but think what you wish.
Now, rather than continue dissecting this whole nasty situation publically, I will quote a message that I posted to our own group, and leave it at that. I have permission to do so. ;-)
"Initially, I encouraged Talitha to join a group of some type, christian ladies, homemakers, others who wear a head covering etc., in order to be able to learn and share with women of like mind. She had no experience in groups or anything of the kind of online communication, other than email and chat, which she no longer does. So far, the only other Christian women she has found who are willing to learn and share with her are those of this group, and has met with significant rejection over and over again.
Anyway, I know we are on the fringe in a few ways, but overall our beliefs are no different than those of the majority of mainstream Christianity...perhaps we only hold them a little stronger, and feel more comfortable leaning on scripture, rather than our own understanding.
Talitha is a tough one, and doesn't seem to take these things too personally (which is good, considering) but in a way I regret ever encouraging her to seek fellowship in such a fashion. It just hasn't worked out very well."
Hopefully this will help towards explaining why she decided to join more than just one group around the same time...as though this is something sinister in itself, or unusual. She found many of the same ladies on other groups, who apparently have similar interests. I'll assume they are under similar suspicion...it's all a ruse to provide fodder for a blog, or to entice others to purchase birthday cakes, or Avon prodcuts. Absurd!
Anyway, I do indeed regret ever exposing her to such groups of Christian ladies.
Grace & Peace,
Joshuah
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